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Topic: Combat mission over in 2009 (Read 431 times)
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Mike Blais
SSM (NATO Bar), CPSM, UN-Cyp, CD
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A ROYAL CANADIAN "NEVER PASSES A FAULT"
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Well, I guess the opposition got what they wanted after all.
We're out by Feb. '09: MacKay
Canada's military mission to Kandahar has an 'expiration date' in 20 months, Harper government tells NATO
CAMPBELL CLARK
From Monday's Globe and Mail
September 3, 2007 at 2:00 AM EDT
OTTAWA — Canada has made it clear to its NATO allies that they cannot count on our troops to fight on the deadly battlefields of southern Afghanistan after February of 2009, Defence Minister Peter MacKay said Sunday.
“The signal that has been sent already is that our current configuration will end in February, 2009,” Mr. MacKay said in an interview on the CTV television program Question Period.
“Obviously the aid work and the diplomatic effort and presence will extend well beyond that. The Afghan compact itself goes until 2011,” he said. “But the way the mission is currently configured, with respect to our presence in Kandahar, there is an expiration date that has been set.”
Mr. MacKay added that the government has committed to a vote in the Commons on Canada's future in Afghanistan. He also said he and Prime Minister Stephen Harper are in regular contact with North Atlantic Treaty Organization officials and their counterparts among NATO countries.
The Globe and Mail
Opposition parties have been pounding away at the government to notify NATO and Afghan allies that the mission will not be extended past February of 2009.
A spokesman, Dan Dugas, said later that the minister hadn't meant that a new signal was recently sent to allies, but that NATO allies are aware that the current mission will go to 2009 “and that there will be a vote in Parliament to decide the way forward after that.”
But as the Conservative government embarks on a new effort to sell Canada's contentious role in Afghanistan, there are increasingly strong indications that the Harper government will not try to extend the Canadian Forces' role in the deadly Kandahar area.
Mr. Harper said in June that the role of Canadian troops there would not be extended unless the opposition supports it – and all three opposition parties have vowed to vote against it.
In interviews over the past week, both Mr. MacKay and Foreign Affairs Minister Maxime Bernier have played down the idea that the Kandahar mission might be extended, and Mr. Bernier has refused to say whether the government wants to prolong the mission.
Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion last week called the government “irresponsible” for failing to notify NATO and Afghanistan that it will not extend the mission in Kandahar, so that another country can be found to take over the role. He pledged to initiate a vote this fall.
One government source said that after recent discussions inside government they now expect that Mr. Harper will ask Parliament to approve a different role in Afghanistan after 2009, rather than an extension of the current Kandahar deployment.
The Afghanistan mission has become increasingly controversial amid a steady stream of casualties. In Quebec, the deployment of the Valcartier, Que.,-based Royal 22nd Regiment, known as the Vandoos, has increased the profile of the mission just before three hotly contested by-elections to be held Sept. 17.
Both the Liberals and the Bloc Québécois have demanded that Mr. Harper immediately state that the mission will not be extended, and the Bloc has threatened to vote against an expected fall Throne Speech unless it includes such a pledge.
Mr. Harper signalled a shift in government message Aug. 14, when he shuffled former defence minister Gordon O'Connor, who was blamed for poorly communicating Canada's role in Afghanistan and making contradictory statements about the mission.
He was replaced by Mr. MacKay, while Quebecker Mr. Bernier was in turn tapped to replace Mr. MacKay at foreign affairs.
On Saturday, Mr. MacKay told The Canadian Press that successes in improving the lives of ordinary Afghans have been overshadowed by the emotional response to the deaths of Canadian soldiers.
“In my opinion, there's a lot of important, tangible evidence and information that has to be relayed to the public more effectively,” he said.
In interviews over the past four days, Mr. MacKay and Mr. Bernier have argued against the idea that Canada is playing chiefly a combat role in Afghanistan.
Instead they have cited a nearly identical list of points to argue that Canada is in Afghanistan under an international mandate along with 37 NATO countries, fighting for the rights and quality of life of Afghans, and making progress. And they have noted the Liberals initiated the mission and the Bloc originally supported it.
Both ministers said that Canada should continue to help Afghanistan for at least four years, noting that the 2006 Afghanistan Compact, in which 60 nations promised to rebuild the strife-torn country, extends until 2011.
But they indicated the Kandahar mission is not likely to be extended past February of 2009.
“2011 for international aid, 2009 for the military mission,” Mr. Bernier told Radio-Canada television last week.
Over the summer, Mr. Harper has also hinted at a shifting role. He told a radio interviewer in July that Canadians expect that if Canada remains after 2009 “it would be a new mission.”
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1RCR 1977-79 Depot (Italy PL), B Coy, Mortars, Pioneers, D Coy (CFB London)
3RCR 1979-82 M Coy, Pipes & Drums, Sigs, Mortars. (CFB Baden-Soellingen)
1RCR 1982-88 Mortars. Dukes, Cyprus-Welfare NCO 84-85, Injured, WO&Sgts Mess, (CFB London)
1988-92 Med-remuster to HELL/ 35 DU, CFB Baden
1992 Medical release. God Bless you all!
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ranrad
Ron [Andy] Andrews
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Well, who is really having their way... this all seems to go in line with the aims of Nato.... after all they, Nato seems to playing some kind of political game here.. the mission is important to stop the insurgents and destroy their ability to be terrorists.. but .. only at a certain speed.. lets draw this out for as long as we can attitude...well, i for one do support us leaving in09, mainly because Nato is NOT being square with us and /or the rest of the world.....the bottom line is to get the job done , and that cannot be complteed with the numbers of trained people they, Nato is allowing...our people have done far better than Nato thought they could...ranrad
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RCAF,CAF, converted RCR?,1RCR 74-77 CD: SSM (Nato);CPSM,;UN-Cyp.; UN- Golan
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Gerry Connors
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Well, let's take a look into the (possible) future.
Feb '09; due to pressure from the opposition, the government withdraws Canadian troops from a combat role to a security / aid role. Some of our NATO allies (mostly those who had little if any troops deployed in the 'Stan) frown upon our withdrawal.
Due to the void of the withdrawal of Canadain troops from a combat role and the failure of other countries willing to fill the combat role, the Taliban filtrate back into the vacancies left. By summer, the opposition parties of Canada are up in arms as to what the ruling government is willing to do to stop the increase of kidnappings, muders of foreign aid workers; increased bombings; the annilhation of hard fought basic human rights (parents fear sending their daughters back to schools; women are severly punished for violating any breach of extremist conduct and dress; civilians are punished for any material not comforming to Taliban rule; those accused of having consorted with the enemy are systemetically 'tried' and executed).
F***ing politicians
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CFRC Gagetown / Fredericton '02 - '06; 'retired' Aug '06
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ranrad
Ron [Andy] Andrews
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Im afraid that what you forsee is likely what will occur.....and may God have mercy on the innocents who will pay the price...then on the rest of the world for we will be back where we started.....and Nato will likely be no more.... not that they are much right now anyway... they have allowed themselves to become poliyticians instead of military.....so yes <Gerry , may God help us all.....the ball has been dropped and unless someone catches it it will explode in the fires of hell on earth......ranrad
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RCAF,CAF, converted RCR?,1RCR 74-77 CD: SSM (Nato);CPSM,;UN-Cyp.; UN- Golan
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Mike Blais
SSM (NATO Bar), CPSM, UN-Cyp, CD
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A ROYAL CANADIAN "NEVER PASSES A FAULT"
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I hate to say it but, realistically, what brother Connors has suggested will happen, is already happening. And has been happening ever since the wackos realized that a majority of the countries that are a part of NATO are gutless and, while they talk a good fight, once the shit hits the fan, its run for the f'n hills.
IMO, the only solution to this clusterfyck is the emergence of a political leader that can rally NATO not, as demonstrated by the walking cliches of the conservative government and their pet general, spout platitudes for a couple of years then roll over and play dead. And since Bush has no credibility and neither, apparently, does harper, where the hell odes that leave us?
Footnotes in history?
And at what expense to The Regiment? I mean, did not the 1st and Finest kick ass in Operation Medusa, have we not demonstrated that the battle can be won?
Were I the PM, I would have used our presence as leverage.
I would have told them last year at the conclusion of Operation Medusa that the NATO commitment to the heart of the badlands is is not acceptable, that an alliance cannot work with out a hundred percent commitment BY ALL STATES and, if the nations that composed this alliance were to gutless to come to the dance when the gauntlet had been thrown, we, as a nation, would be better off withdrawing from NATO and taking concrete measures to protect ourselves.
Instead of contracting out territorial defense, as it has been since 1949, an a bunch of gutless flakes who only know how to take.
Command performance
Mission has created 'organizational perfect storm'
David Pugliese
The Ottawa Citizen
Tuesday, September 04, 2007
EXCLUSIVE: Gen. Rick Hillier's plan to streamline the military with four new commands has been derailed by the war in Afghanistan, and the command in charge of protecting Canadians at home isn't getting the priority it should, a 'chilling' new DND report says
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The military command whose job is to help Canadians at home in the event of a terrorist attack or natural disaster is not getting the attention or priority it should because the country's generals are focused on the Afghanistan war, according to a report produced for Gen. Rick Hillier and leaked to the Citizen.
At the same time, Canadian Forces personnel assigned to another command in charge of the Afghanistan mission are burning out from too much work and their organization is not seen to be sustainable in the long run.
The 62-page report produced in January for chief of defence staff Gen. Hillier details the progress of his ambitious plan to transform the Canadian Forces into an organization that is efficient, relevant and responsive to the needs of the government and public.
The transformation process was officially launched with much fanfare 18 months ago with the establishment of four new commands designed to streamline and improve the way the military does its work.
But around the same time as the transformation process was launched, the Afghanistan war began heating up and that conflict has continued to dominate Canadian military and foreign affairs policy.
It is the Afghanistan mission, combined with the military trying to recruit a large number of new troops and move quickly on the purchases of major pieces of new equipment, that has significantly taxed the Defence Department's Ottawa headquarters, affected the transformation process and created what the report calls "an organizational perfect storm."
In addition, the report found there has been duplication or triplication of efforts among the various commands since few of the new procedures or specific responsibilities involved in the transformation process were written down.
The study, done by three retired senior officers at the request of Gen. Hillier, outlines, in part, the impact of the Afghan war on some of the new organizations, including Canada Command. That command is responsible for overseeing operations in Canada, keeping an eye on the coasts and airspace and responding to a crisis at home. The command would also provide support to civilian agencies in the event of a terrorist attack or natural disaster.
But the report points out that Canada Command is not getting the intelligence data it needs and is in competition for resources with other organizations.
"With the overwhelming and understandable emphasis on operations in Afghanistan, Canada COM is not getting the attention and priority that might otherwise be the case," the report by the transformation validation team points out.
"Canada COM remains very much a command in waiting, for, while the command has executed over 40 operations during the past year, most have been fairly routine in nature and, thus, not a true test of the command's overall capability," the study adds.
"Like all, the Team hopes that those tests will come in the form of planned domestic operations, and not in the form of a crisis response!"
The war has also taken a toll on the Canadian Expeditionary Force Command, which is responsible for running international operations. Although CEFCOM, as it's called, has effectively managed the Afghan mission, it has been unable to focus on its other jobs, according to the report.
"The demands of Afghanistan have also precluded the Command from focusing on the other roles deemed to be inherent in CEFCOM's mandate: scanning the global environment, contingency planning, engaging strategic partners and shaping, synchronizing and sustaining operational capabilities."
CEFCOM staff interviewed for the report said they have "little or no time to think" and have been unable to work on doctrine, policies, processes and procedures.
"CEFCOM assesses that the command is stretched thin, not really sustainable over the longer term, and that many of its personnel are facing personal burnout," the report adds.
Liberal Senator Colin Kenny, chairman of the Senate's defence committee, described the report's findings as "chilling."
"What you take away from this report is that there didn't seem to be a whole lot of planning and foresight put into this (transformation) proposal," said Mr. Kenny.
He noted that transformation was supposed to streamline the military leadership structure and make it more efficient, but instead has created more organizations that need more staff, that are now duplicating each other's efforts.
"Before all this started, we had a system that worked pretty good," he added, referring to the position of the deputy chief of the defence staff, which, along with other offices, handled many of the responsibilities taken over by the new commands. "Clearly, this report is questioning whether there has been a benefit to transformation."
But Col. Stephen Christensen, the director of transformation co-ordination, said the message to take away from the report is that the process is on track and that it is a lengthy undertaking with changes to be made along the way.
He acknowledged the report notes Canada Command is not getting as much attention from Gen. Hillier, as well as the necessary resources, because of the focus on Afghanistan. But he added: "I don't believe that you will have seen anything in there that suggests it is getting insufficient attention to meet the requirements.
"We know there are things we need to continue to work on, to shape, that we still aren't as good as we can be to responding in Canada," Col. Christensen added.
"To get to that we need to continue to work on Canada Command, its structure, resourcing and command relationships."
He said that since the report was delivered, Canada Command has been involved in dealing with forest fires in British Columbia. It is now heavily involved in security planning for the 2010 Olympics.
Col. Christensen also said the issues outlined in the report are being dealt with. He said CEFCOM's skilful handling of the Afghanistan mission is an example of one of the successes of the transformation process.
In addition, the report highlights the success of the Canadian Operational Support Command, which is responsible for support to military missions at home and abroad, transporting equipment, supplies and troops and well as providing military engineers, health services and military police.
The report points out that the command's response to international operations has proved its capability to move critical stocks of supplies and equipment across Canada. But it also adds that because of the pressures of current operations, the command has not been able to develop doctrine or procedures, key elements of a well-functioning military organization.
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1RCR 1977-79 Depot (Italy PL), B Coy, Mortars, Pioneers, D Coy (CFB London)
3RCR 1979-82 M Coy, Pipes & Drums, Sigs, Mortars. (CFB Baden-Soellingen)
1RCR 1982-88 Mortars. Dukes, Cyprus-Welfare NCO 84-85, Injured, WO&Sgts Mess, (CFB London)
1988-92 Med-remuster to HELL/ 35 DU, CFB Baden
1992 Medical release. God Bless you all!
Pro Patria
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ranrad
Ron [Andy] Andrews
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Sounds like our own in house problems need a huge infusion of troops as well...hmmm, and it sounds like were in a h** of a mess all round... but is it that bad??? Were it not for very well trained people over there i believe it would be a near disaster...some Generals got a hell of a lot of work ahead of them....  may i wish em all good luck ... ranrad
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RCAF,CAF, converted RCR?,1RCR 74-77 CD: SSM (Nato);CPSM,;UN-Cyp.; UN- Golan
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David
David (George) Ward
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I don't know about the withdrawals as the Commissionaire of Canada have been asked to deploy to Kandahar airfield to man the front gates. I am a site Corporal and have applied to support the troops. So far this is a one year contract. We will be working for a civilian company over there
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David Ward
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