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ranrad
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown
« Reply #270 on: November 19, 2007, 09:21:03 AM »
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Hmmmm, very wise words here , i think.. hope many will read and spread the word on this TRAGEDY...ranrad
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (A Letter to the Editor)
« Reply #271 on: November 19, 2007, 01:42:41 PM »
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In response to; "Canadian athletes to be paid for winning at
Olympics."

Twenty Thousand Dollars, this may sounds familiar because it seems to
be Ottawa's answer to almost everything. Not all that long ago One
percent (1%) of CFB Gagetown toxic chemical Victims were offered what
I suppose would amount to an Olympic Gold medal for as much as 40
years of pain and suffering they have endured, however this $20,000
cash is where the similarities end.

Canada or Ottawa will take full responsibility for every medal won at
the Olympics. The winners will not only receive $20,000 but they will
be honored, cheered across Canada, TV and Radio interviews, home
coming parades, have their names added to an elite list of honored
Olympic Canadians and receive a medal for their troubles. And these
are only the apparent differences after winning.

One must never forget that most if not all Athletes' training for the
Olympics, have personal trainers, special medical attention, team
doctors, free education (scholarships), in many cases low costs or
free housing and the list goes on.

Does this mean that Olympic winners do not deserve $20,000 for wining
a medal?

No!

It means that not one of the 1% of Gagetown Victims' eligible for
compensation is being offered what Canada owes them, in fact they
aren't even being offered what a Canadian Athlete is offered and the
other 99% are getting nothing, absolutely nothing.

Cpl. Kenneth H. Young CD (Ret'd).
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown
« Reply #272 on: November 20, 2007, 09:21:25 AM »
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Exactly... you are right bang on with that Ken.. bang on...will there ever be justice and fairness??? Maybe , once the class action goes thru the courts.. evidently not before.. and of course, by being ordered by a court ,the gov, whoever they are at the time, is being " ordered" , so , in that way , do escape  blame and real responsibility...the Cdn way  eh???  ranrad
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (Another Letter)
« Reply #273 on: November 20, 2007, 05:06:03 PM »
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If the Canadian Olympians feel $20,000 is insignificant, how can
Thompson feel that it is sufficient for the Gagetown Victims?

I watched CTV News last night in total disbelief as one Canadian
Olympic Athlete after another stated that they felt the $20,000
offered to the CFB Gagetown Toxic Chemical Contamination Victims was
insignificant and didn't realistically reflect the actual costs
involved.

Well they were actually talking about their Ottawa $20,000 offer for
achieving a Gold Medal but in any case to hear perfectly healthy
Canadians claiming that $20,000 was in their view insignificant, when
Greg Thompson seems to think that this amount was more then enough
for dieing veterans affected by Ottawa's decision to use Agent Orange
in CFB Gagetown and for forty years of medical problems.

And to be totally fair some of the Athletes had the very same
attitude as most Gagetown Victims or at least the 1% even eligible
for compensation and claimed that $20,000 was better then what they
had been receiving in the past and definitely better then nothing.
And just like the Gagetown compensation package this money doesn't
solve the problem and only compensates 1% of the Athletes affected.

Cpl. Kenneth H. Young CD (Ret'd).



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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (NZ Newson AO Compensation)
« Reply #274 on: November 20, 2007, 05:07:55 PM »
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Payments made to Vietnam veterans, families
NZPA | Wednesday, 21 November 2007

Email a Friend | Printable View | Have Your SayRelated Links

Ex-gratia payments have been made to the first 50 defence veterans and
families exposed to Agent Orange during the Vietnam War.

Under the agreement reached last year veterans exposed to Agent Orange
received a $30 million package that included an apology from the Government.

Ex-gratia payments are being made to veterans with certain medical
conditions, the spouses of veterans with these conditions who have died, and
children who have suffered health effects.

Veterans Affairs Minister Rick Barker yesterday said Veterans Affairs had
paid out 50 ex-gratia payments.

Of the payments so far, 27 were made to veterans themselves and 23 went to
families of Vietnam veterans, totalling $1.75m.

When the Memorandum of Understanding was reached last year with the Returned
Services Association and the Ex-Vietnam Services Association, it was
estimated eight to 10 ex-gratia payments would go directly to veterans
themselves.

"So the number is actually higher, and this is concerning, but it is also
gratifying that support is going to the Vietnam veterans," Mr Barker said
yesterday.

Of the estimated 3500 who served in Vietnam, 1400 veterans were receiving a
war disablement pension.

Mr Barker said more than 4500 Vietnam veterans and their families had
registered with Veterans Affairs as part of the agreement.

They need to register their details so they can be helped if their health
suffers from exposure to the defoliant Agent Orange.

Mr Barker also said the Vietnam Veterans and Their Families Trust had been
established and was accepting applications from veterans and their families
for financial assistance for conditions that were not explicitly dealt with
in the memorandum of understanding.

The process for a comprehensive medical check was being finalised, work was
under way to implement an expert panel, an oral history project had begun,
and planning was under way for a tribute to veterans in 2008.

Cpl. Kenneth H. Young CD (Ret'd).
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (AOAC Press release Part #1)
« Reply #275 on: November 22, 2007, 03:33:18 PM »
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Agent Orange Advocacy Association of Canada Calls for A Full Public
Inquiry

Introduction:
My name is Bill Gerd'son, Vice-President of the Agent Orange Advocacy
Association of Canada and my colleague with me is Marilynn
Kirchgessner, an active member of our Association who grew up in
Oromocto and whose family has lived there for over 46 years.

I wish to provide an update on our position regarding the actions by
the Federal Government over the spray program at C.F.B Gagetown
during the period 1956 to 1985 and the damage it has done to so many
lives, as well as the ecosystem of this large parcel of land called
the Gagetown Training Area. I will also be addressing the
Compensation Package offered by DND.

Background:
As most of you are aware, in May of 2005, the Canadian media reported
that in 1966 and 1967, Agent Orange (DEADLY DIOXIN) was sprayed at
Canadian Forces Base Gagetown by the U.S military.
The Department of National Defense (DND) claimed that the American
military had sprayed approximately 2 ½ barrels (589 liters) of Agent
Orange for a total of 3 days in 1966 and for 4 days in 1967.

Ms. Karen Ellis stated in June, 2005 at the C.F.B Gagetown Theatre
that Agent Orange was sprayed on the 2nd to the 5th of June in 1966.
Our Association has DND documents that show Agent Orange, as well as
numerous other highly toxic chemicals, were sprayed from June 12th to
the 16th in 1966. This has never been made public so we are asking
how many other spray programs are being hidden from the public.

Through the Access to Information Act, it was discovered that our own
Department of National Defence, in fact, sprayed deadly Dioxin and
Hexachlorobenzene (Hexa-chlor-o-benzene) laced defoliants for 28
years, from 1956 to 1984. They sprayed Agent Orange for 8 years
before the Americans ever arrived and Dioxin and other deadly
herbicides, including Agent Orange, Agent Purple and Agent White,
over the Base Gagetown Training Area for 20 years after they left.

DND sprayed a total of over 1.3 million liters of liquid defoliants
Agent Orange, Agent Purple and Agent White containing deadly Dioxin
and Hexachlorobenzene during that time.

IN ADDITION, they sprayed over 1 million kilograms of dry Agent White
containing Dioxin and Hexachlorobenzene during that period.

The Department of National Defense and federal government have only
discussed the spraying by the Americans for 7 days in 1966 and 1967,
completely ignoring the 28 years that they themselves sprayed these
deadly herbicides over the Base Gagetown Training area.

DND finally admitted to the other 28 years that they themselves
sprayed
after being publicly taken to task by dedicated people in our
Association.

It should be noted that all the Agents: Agent Orange, Agent Purple,
Agent White, are named due to the color stripes on the barrels to
readily identify the contained chemicals and their ratios to military
personnel.

Agent Orange refers to a barrel that contains 2 chemicals mixed
50:50, one of which was contaminated with dioxin. These very same
chemicals were sprayed by DND under their scientific names 2,4-D and
2,4,5-T in the same mixture of 50:50, and other ratios. Only the
Americans called 2,4-D and 2,4,5-T Agent Orange and Agent Purple and
Agent White but they're one and the same.

The Base Gagetown and Area Fact Finder Project (BFAFFP), a NON-
independent fact finding review group, had been put in place by the
government as a public relations exercise.

It appeared to be a public inquiry but it was not. Its original co-
ordinator had resigned citing health reasons and had been replaced by
Dr. Dennis Furlong who was reportedly at the BGAFFP office only 2
days per week.

The mandate of the Fact Finding Project was to obtain facts and give
the facts to the federal government. It was not permitted to offer
suggestions to the government.

This; for a cost of approximately $1,500,000. Now that this phase
was completed, the general public became well aware of how the
government was attempting to downplay and minimize this event as much
as possible.

The Fact Finding Project used faulty reports and, in my opinion,
fudged the numbers in the three phases of the project in order to
eliminate as many victims as possible, as claimants.

In 2005, while Mr. Harper and MP Greg Thompson were in Opposition, it
was a very straight forward problem as far as they were concerned and
with months of loud demands to the then governing Liberal party to
compensate now and dump the BGAFFP, Mr. Thompson was easily elected
for another term in Ottawa. Isn't it sad how power corrupts?

Greg Thompson, after being appointed Veterans Affairs Minister,
became conspicuous by his silence. As the Gagetown issue, out of the
blue, became more complicated, the BGAFFP became essential to any
Compensation Package that might be offered. The only thing that
remained constant was that Ottawa would only do an Ex-Gratia payment,
while accepting neither guilt nor responsibility, for what their
predecessors in Ottawa had done to both their own troops and the
civilians who lived and worked in and around CFB Gagetown during
those 28 years.

On July 12, 2007, DVA Minister Greg Thompson said the compensation
package he hoped to announce for victims of Agent Orange by Labour
Day would go further than the recommendations that he and MLA Jody
Carr pushed for two years ago when he was in Opposition.

Mr. Thompson stated: "We issued nine recommendations for how Ottawa
should respond to the claims by hundreds of veterans and civilians
that their health had been harmed by exposure to Agent Orange and
other herbicides sprayed at CFB Gagetown."

"What Jody and I were attempting to do is push the government to
where we wanted and (now) we're there." Thompson said. "We have even
done work over and above the nine recommendations. We've done things
in addition to what we outlined."

The nine recommendations were not addressed within the compensation
package and, in our opinion, were just a media ploy to minimize
public attention.

DND's Compensation Package:

In brief, the Agent Orange compensation deal finally announced by
Minister of Veterans Affairs Greg Thompson on September 12, 2007, was
a slap in the face to the thousands of people who had hung high hopes
on a government that declared over and over again that they would
look after the victims of the spraying.

Stephen Harper, in his pre-election speech in Woodstock, N.B. on
January 11th, 2006 said: "A Conservative government will stand up
for full and fair compensation to persons exposed to defoliant
spraying during the period from 1956 to 1984."

He didn't keep that promise. DND has not addressed the spraying over
those 28 years, only the 7 days that the Americans sprayed.

Using the narrowest possible window of only the years 1966 and 1967
as being the only 2 years of spraying, while accepting no
responsibility, our federal government has effectively eliminated
hundreds of thousands of people.

This apparent attempt to blame the U.S for the spraying fails in the
fact that Canada invited the U.S military to spray Agent Orange at
CFB Gagetown.

With the "magic date" of February 6, 2006, when the "New Government"
took office, set as the eligibility date for compensation for
individuals who died on or after that date, thousands of families of
veterans and civilians who died before that date have been totally
eliminated from the compensation process.
As well, in order to qualify for this one-time $20,000 payment,
individuals must have an illness associated with exposure to
contaminants in Agent Orange (dioxin), as determined by the U.S.
National Academy of Sciences Institute of Medicine (IoM). The
problem with this is that Mr. Thompson and his government are using
the list of diseases recognized by the IoM in 2004. The IoM
published a new list of diseases in 2006 adding Hypertension and AL
amyloidosis, since medical research has shown that exposure to Agent
Orange would cause these as well.
AL amyloidosis is a hematological disorder. In primary (AL)
amyloidosis, the organs most often involved include the heart,
kidneys, nervous system and gastro-intestinal tract. Amyloid
deposits in these organs can cause shortness of breath, fatigue,
edema (swelling of the ankles and legs), dizziness upon standing, a
feeling of fullness in the stomach (especially after eating),
diarrhea, weight loss, enlarged tongue, numbness of the legs and arms
and protein in the urine.
So, not only is the government cheating thousands of veterans and
civilians by severely limiting the timeframes they were exposed to
these deadly herbicides, they are also excluding the new diseases
already internationally recognized by the IoM.
The government's use of the IoM's list of diseases caused by dioxin
only has excluded probably 98% of the people harmed as a result of
being to the numerous other deadly herbicides sprayed at CFB Gagetown.

This thoughtless government has also left out the children who are
now sick due to the DNA changes these chemicals caused their
parents. Those few who do qualify for compensation have to basically
start the process all over again, at their own expense, to obtain the
pittance of $20,000 – an amount many will spend in one year alone for
drugs needed to stay alive.

The misuse of facts and figures has represented a serious miscarriage
of justice for the victims of the CFB Gagetown defoliant spraying and
leaves only the courts and a Full Public Inquiry as a final avenue to
resolving this issue.

Conclusion:
We have heard lately of the demands for a public inquiry regarding
the dealings Mr. Mulroney had with a private citizen from another
country. The politicians feel this is worth 30 million dollars of
taxpayers money to find out why Mr. Mulroney received $300,000 of non-
taxpayers money from this individual.

Yet, when it comes to one of the largest health tragedies in Canadian
history, the House of Commons is silent, with the exception of Peter
Stoffer of the NDP Party. Many of us have sent emails to our Member
of Parliament and received back a "deleted without being read"
response.

These are the same people who pop their faces in front of the nearest
camera on Remembrance Day and state how much respect they have for
the Veterans of this country for all they have done. These are the
same people who go to Ottawa to serve themselves rather than the
people of this great country.

We are subjected to Departments such as DND and Veteran Affairs
policing themselves, as they did when they ran their own
investigation into the spraying that they themselves did, denying
justice to the thousands of veterans that served and sacrificed for
this country with such dignity.

The Department of Veteran Affairs has a legislated mandate to provide
assistance to veterans, yet the appointed bureaucrats are allowed to
violate this mandate each and every day, even though they have never
donned a uniformed on behalf of Canada. Are our sons and daughters
who are serving our country in Afghanistan going to receive the same
treatment when they require assistance?

How many Members of Parliament have sons and daughters serving in
this war zone? I would shudder to hear the number.

We firmly believe the governments of the day have committed the
following crimes:

Crime # 1: The Canadian government allowed untested chemicals to
be used on us.

Crime # 2: The Canadian government ignored scientific data that
emerged in the late 60's, maybe earlier; that showed those chemicals
were dangerous to human health.

Crime # 3: The Canadian government initiated a massive cover-up.

The Agent Orange Association of Canada truly believes that the only
path to the truth regarding this tragedy is for a full public inquiry
to be called immediately.

The many who have had their lives shortened; those who have spent
years suffering from illnesses; those who have lost loved ones or
watched them suffer from the effects of their chemicals deserve
nothing less.

Therefore, we are asking every politician, every newspaper and every
TV network to pressure this government into calling for a full public
inquiry. The time of spending tax-payers hard earned dollars to
protect the chemical companies is over. We must never forget that
the chemicals that have affected so many in the past are having the
same effect on those exposed to them today.

Thank you for your time.

Bill Gerd'son CD
Vice-President
Agent Orange Advocacy Association of Canada

Tel: (506) 357-3608
Email: gerdson@nb.sympatico.ca
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (AOAC Press release Part #2)
« Reply #276 on: November 22, 2007, 03:34:52 PM »
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Good afternoon. My name is Marilynn Kirchgessner.

I grew up and lived in the civilian area of Oromocto. My family was
one of the first to move to the new Town in 1960. Many of us
civilian kids went to school with friends whose parents were in the
military.

The civilian population was quite small compared to the military
population. I'd say there were about 20 of us students from the Town
and outlying areas going to Oromocto High in the early 1960's. Today
there are very few of us left.

So many of my friends have died, and died young, in the 1960's, 70's
and 80's. Too many of their fathers died young. There were just so
many deaths – my brother included at the age of 53 – for such a small
population. Everyone back then knew that something was wrong and
worried about the spraying.

Many families like mine still live in Oromocto after almost 50 years
and have seen the illnesses and deaths of their friends and neighbors
around them and experienced losses themselves.

In the Town and communities surrounding the Base such as Burton,
Geary, Hoyt, Enniskillen and Blissville, just about every family has
been touched with an illness or lost a loved one.

I have a 3 page partial list of names of those deceased and dying in
the Hoyt/Enniskillen area, communities closest to the training area
that was the heaviest sprayed. Some wells were only 100 meters from
the border of the spray area.

Entire families there have been wiped out from cancer and many at a
young age. For a tiny population, the numbers are staggering. These
communities were hit the hardest.

No one from DND has ever talked to me, or to anyone that I know,
during their so-called investigations.

Obviously, the locals who stood up and told their stories at the Fact
Finding Mission's Town Hall meetings were not listened to by
representatives of DND. Had they been, DND would have realized that
the number of deaths and rates of illness in these small communities
are exceptionally high.

Instead, they concluded in their report that "only a few" people were
affected by the spraying. It's just baffling how they could make
such a statement.

I often wonder about my military friends who moved away. And what
about the others who went to school in Oromocto during those years?
How many of them are still alive today? How many of their fathers
died young?

Military families were posted in and out of Gagetown during those 28
years, some many times over, and they're now spread all across
Canada. DND made only a feeble effort to contact these people and
failed.

Because DND did not take into account the health status of the
military and civilian families now living outside the province, their
studies are incomplete and seriously flawed. They kept this a local
issue, for some reason, and that was wrong.

This compensation package is an insult to all of us who are sick and
dying and to the memory of those who have passed away.

DND has not acknowledged their role in the spraying nor taken
responsibility for their actions. DND has certainly not acted
compassionately towards the victims and their families. If they had,
they would have included ALL the victims in their compensation
package, including those who became sick and died BEFORE February
6th, 2006, due to their exposure to these deadly herbicides.

How can the lives of those who had the misfortune of passing away
before the February 6th, 2006 date that the Conservatives took power,
be any less valuable than those who, sadly, passed away, and will
pass away after that date?

Mr. Thompson should not be too proud of his efforts. We expected
more from him and he let us down terribly.

DND must be held accountable for their actions and ALL victims who
lost their lives and are suffering today due to DND's actions must
be compensated.

Since they have not done so, we will now, unfortunately, have to
resort to the courts to do the job they didn't.

We demand a Public Inquiry. Only then will the truth and magnitude
of what happened at Base Gagetown during those 28 years come out.
The victims deserve answers.

Thank you for your time.

Marilynn Kirchgessner


(506) 458-1132
Email: mare7@nb.sympatico.ca
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (By MICHAEL STAPLES)
« Reply #277 on: November 23, 2007, 06:16:13 AM »
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Association says Agent Orange was sprayed at CFB Gagetown more than originally thought Compensation | Veterans Affairs says dates are already included in current package
 

By MICHAEL STAPLES
staples.michael@dailygleaner.com

Published Friday November 23rd, 2007

Appeared on page A4

The Agent Orange Association of Canada says new information suggests the toxic defoliant was sprayed at Canadian Forces Base Gagetown more often in the 1960s than originally believed.

At a news conference Thursday, Bill Gerd'son, the association's vice-president, released documents showing Agent Orange, as well as numerous other toxic chemicals, was sprayed on base from June 12-16, 1966.

"The Department of National Defence claimed that the American military had sprayed approximately 2½ barrels (589 litres) of Agent Orange for a total of three days in 1966 and for four days in 1967."

Gerd'son said since the dates had never been made public previously, he wonders how many other spray programs are being hidden from the public.

As a result of the discovery, the association said it's renewing its call for a public inquiry into the use of chemical spraying at Canadian Forces Base Gagetown.

Gerd'son said the federal government's misuse of facts and figures is a serious miscarriage of justice for victims of defoliant spraying.

"The Agent Orange Association of Canada truly believes that the only path to the truth regarding this tragedy is for a full public inquiry to be called immediately," Gerd'son said. "The many who have had their lives shortened, those who have spent years suffering from illnesses, those who have lost loved ones or watched them suffer from the effects of their chemicals deserve nothing less."

The federal government has repeatedly rejected calls for such an inquiry.

In September, Veterans Affairs Minister Greg Thompson announced veterans and civilians impacted by the spraying of Agent Orange at CFB Gagetown during the 1960s were eligible for $20,000 in compensation as part of a $95.6-million package.

Left out of the mix were individuals who claimed they were impacted by the spraying of other herbicides at CFB Gagetown between 1956 and 1984.

Janice Summerby, a media-relations adviser with Veterans Affairs Canada, said the department always welcomes new information because it could be useful to people applying for disability pensions.

It wouldn't impact the compensation program because those dates are already included for eligibility, she said.

"It's the entire summer of '66 and '67 that count for residents, or those who worked or lived on the base," Summerby said.

The extra spray incident, meanwhile, was discovered in an Aug. 6, 1966, military document designed to outline U.S. participation in vegetation control at CFB Gagetown, Gerd'son said.

Sixteen two-acre plots "were sprayed with Purple, Orange, M2993, Phytar 160, Phytar 560, Tordon 101, Tordon 22X, Diquat, and various combinations of these."

According to the documents, the general area was along a trail leading from the western boundary of the camp East-North-East to Gillan's Corner. The helicopter and photo aircraft used the Blissville Airstrip

Some of the plots were showing effects of the herbicides within hours after treatment, noted the documents.

The association also stressed that commercially available chemicals known as 2-4-5-T and 2-4-D used at the base to keep forest growth in check in the years preceding and following the use of Agent Orange were the same chemicals.

Gerd'son also criticized the government's compensation package, describing it as inadequate.

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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (RESEARCH SUGGESTS LINK BETWEEN PESTICIDES AND BRAIN
« Reply #278 on: November 23, 2007, 06:40:04 AM »
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(we always thought that they were nuts)
***********************************


www.msrc.co.uk : Pesticides and Multiple Sclerosis

 

RESEARCH SUGGESTS LINK BETWEEN PESTICIDES AND BRAIN DISEASE

 

Researchers at the University of North Dakota say preliminary research shows a link between pesticide exposure and neurological diseases like Parkinson and Alzheimer’s.  Researchers say they've also identified a surprisingly efficient way pesticides may get into the human body.

 

Researchers at the University of North Dakota are quick to point out these are preliminary results -- covering one year of a planned four-year study.  But Dr. Patrick Carr says there's clear evidence pesticide exposure at relatively low doses affect brain cells.  "Some areas of the brain displayed what I would call physical changes -- in other words, a loss of neurons in particular regions of the brain," says Carr.  "In other regions of the brain you wouldn't notice a change in the number of cells present there, but now the cells that are present there are expressing chemicals in different amounts, compared to normal rats."

 

As an example, Carr found cells responsible for production of a substance called myelin were damaged or destroyed.  Myelin is a substance made up of fats and proteins that encloses nerves.  It helps transmit signals along the nerves.  Loss of myelin causes nerve damage in neurological diseases such as multiple sclerosis.

 

Researchers studied six common pesticides.  Carr says some rats were given a single large dose, while others were injected with small doses over a nine-month period.  "It's hard to then correlate that to what the average person that's working with pesticides would be exposed to," says Carr.  "We're not at that position yet, where we can say this is comparable to what these people working with pesticides, short term or long term, are exposed to."

 

Dr. Carr hopes to have his results completely analyzed by next spring.  Gerald Groenwald, director of energy and environmental research, says there's clearly a need to continue and expand the research.  "What this research says is that we have started to open some doors and shine some light in a very objective fashion, a very comprehensive fashion, on this group of questions," says Groenwald.  "And it says, more than ever, that this research is extremely important not only here in the Red River Valley, but basically globally."

 

Groenwald says other researchers are also looking at ways people are exposed to pesticides.  He says people commonly think of being exposed to pesticides through contaminated water or food.  But he believes the most efficient means of exposure is through tiny airborne particles of pollen.

 

Groenwald says some beneficial drugs are delivered as tiny particles, which are inhaled deep into the lungs.

 

He says researchers found tiny bits of pollen carried on the wind carry with them a load of pesticide.  "Frankly, if there is a link between pesticides and these diseases, I think the very fine pollen is the transport mechanism, and is in some cases you might say the smoking gun," he says.  Groenwald says because there are relatively few competing airborne pollutants in the Red River Valley, it's a perfect place to study airborne pesticide pollution.

 

Groenwald hopes to continue and expand the study over the next three years, depending on how much funding the research receives.

 

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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown
« Reply #279 on: November 23, 2007, 08:47:57 AM »
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In reply to “Saginaw River dioxin find spreads fear” published in the US.

Today in the age of the computers and the internet, Companies such as Dow and Monsanto need to get their world wide cover (their butts) stories striate and maybe they aught to compare notes before making conflicting and dumb statements.

They can’t continue to claim that the dioxin levels found in the Saginaw River were from some Dioxin dumped over one hundred years ago in the USA wile at the same time they claim dioxin dumped on unsuspecting soldiers at CFB Gagetown would evaporate before hitting the ground and in any case would dissipate annually.

This is an insult to Human intelligence and by the looks of things the only people who believe this line of dribble seems to be the Governments who themselves were guilty of spraying their own people.

Cpl. Kenneth H. Young CD (Ret'd).
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The story***************************

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071123/METRO/711230361
 
Friday, November 23, 2007
Saginaw River dioxin find spreads fear
Discovery of high levels of toxin have residents worried that outdoor activities put them at risk.
Francis X. Donnelly / The Detroit News
SAGINAW -- At the spot where two rivers join to form the Saginaw River, clumps of cattails and bald cypress share the sandy shores with deer and raccoon tracks.
For years, this scenic tableau has filled riverside residents such as Mitch Larson with dread.
The reason became clear last week when the river confluence yielded something never conceived by nature: toxic dioxin.
The chemical, dumped into the Tittabawassee River by Dow Chemical Co. a century ago, had been discovered in other parts of the streams but never in this quantity, a federal agency said.
Not even close.
Larson worries about the health of his four daughters as he wonders whether this is the price Michigan residents pay for the state's industrial past.
"My daughters were raised out there," said the autoworker, 50, who lives 300 yards from the latest hot spot. "I'm worried for their children."
Traveling along two rivers, the dangerous chemical cuts a 44-mile swath through central Michigan, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency said.
Residents who once loved their proximity to the rivers now fear it.
They worry how the simplest outdoor activity may have exposed them to the carcinogen -- fishing, swimming, gardening, cutting the grass.
Dioxin clings to dirt, so sometimes it creeps all the way into homes, state studies have found.
'Most toxic'
In Midland, the headquarters of Dow Chemical looks like a city-sized erector set.
It's three square miles of tanks, pipes and pumps. Dow, one of the biggest chemical manufacturers, makes or made Styrofoam, Saran Wrap, a wide array of plastics and, at one time, Agent Orange, an herbicide used in Vietnam.
The company spewed dioxin into the air or dumped it into the Tittabawassee River for half a century, Dow said. The chemical is a byproduct of the manufacture of chemicals and pesticides.
"At the time, the waste management approach was to release byproducts into the river," Dow spokesman John Musser said.
"That's not unique to Dow. We've learned a lot in the years since."
The toxin flowed 22 miles to Saginaw, entered the Saginaw River and moved another 22 miles past Bay City into the Saginaw Bay.
Moving by air and water, the long-lasting substance settled into the soil and river bottom.
The contaminant damages livers, weakens immune systems and affects reproduction, EPA studies have found.
"It's one of the most toxic chemicals ever evaluated by the EPA or any agency," said Milton Clark, senior health adviser in EPA's regional office in Chicago. "It has very high cancer potency."
Part of the issue is that the state and federal government have vastly different standards for what is an acceptable level of dioxin. State action is triggered by readings of 90 parts per trillion; federal action is triggered at 1,000 parts per trillion, a level Dow insists is more reasonable.
Still, widespread water sampling in recent years has found spots that far exceed even federal standards.
Before last week, the heaviest dose of dioxin found in the Saginaw River was 32,000 parts per trillion. The heaviest in the Tittabawassee was 87,000 parts per trillion.  The amount discovered last week near Wickes Park in the Saginaw River was 1.6 million parts per trillion.
River meanders past homes
Outside the gates of the Dow complex in Midland, the Tittabawassee is an unassuming presence: shallow and 50 yards wide.
Last year, Dow discovered three dioxin hot spots along the river within six miles of its property. The company has cleaned up two and will finish the third soon.
In Freeland, the south-moving stream passes many homes, including Kathy Henry's.
Her three acres of gently rolling hills contain a level of dioxin that's a dozen times higher than the state standard.
"It's been devastating," she said. "It's not a way for a resident to live."
Henry, 49, goes outside as little as possible. When she cuts the grass, she wears a dust mask and showers afterward.
Generations of families have lived along the water. While older family members frolicked there, newer ones fear their backyards.
South of Freeland is Imerman Memorial Park, whose 96 acres contains hiking trails, picnic pavilions, canoe rentals, a fishing dock and boat launch.
Given the picturesque surroundings, the park packs a jarring welcome.
"Contamination Advisory," reads a sign. "Avoid contact with soil and river sediment due to dioxin contamination. Use soap and water."
Poor in Saginaw hit worst
If dioxin is one of the costs of heavy manufacturing in Michigan, the poor are bearing a disproportionate share.
The pollutants leave Midland, a tidy city that benefits from the largesse of Dow, and move toward Saginaw, whose median household income is half of Midland's.
For Saginaw residents such as Howard Steinmetz, a riverside home was a status symbol. Now it's an albatross.
Steinmetz, 75, struggled to cobble together enough money to buy a plot along the river. When he finally did so in the late 1960s, he liked to walk along the banks, fantasizing what his new house would look like.
Now he's trying to unload his dream home. But nobody wants it.
"I feel helpless," he said about his dioxin-befouled yard. "I feel abused."
And he feels sick. He has two types of cancer: prostate cancer and non-Hodgkin's lymphoma.
His wife, Barbara, 70, has stomach cancer, and two daughters struggled with infertility.
The family believes their health problems are connected with the dioxin that has been discovered in their bodies.
"I'm not sure when the sword of Damocles will fall," Barbara Steinmetz said.
Others aren't worried.
On Sunday, less than a week after news about the dioxin, half a dozen motorboats circled the spot where the chemical was found.
They weren't scientists or federal regulators or Dow officials.
They were fishermen.
__._,_.___
 
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown
« Reply #280 on: November 23, 2007, 09:54:51 AM »
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And still its deny , deny and outright lie from the gov. which is RESPOSIBLE, whether they admit it or not..i really do wonder how those in charge can sleep at night, any night..it tells me that their constituents  should take a good long look at them and call them to account, all of them...ranrad
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (Mr. Nathan Cullen (Skeena—Bulkley Valley, NDP)
« Reply #281 on: November 23, 2007, 02:29:13 PM »
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Mr. Nathan Cullen (Skeena—Bulkley Valley, NDP):

"Canadians are living with the ill effects of agent orange, agent
purple and others and have not been properly compensated by previous
governments or this one. It was never the intention of government or
the military, in this case, to cause any harm to Canadian soldiers or
workers, of course, yet lo and behold, after many years there is a
list of horrifying health effects. It is very difficult to read
through the literature and not be properly braced with the issue. The
fact is that governments for too long have failed Canadians and for
too long have limited studies."



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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown
« Reply #282 on: November 24, 2007, 10:13:09 AM »
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Well, thank you Mr Cullen, i wonder where all the other MPs are on this  TRAGEDY?Huh?  ranrad
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (In My Opinion)
« Reply #283 on: November 24, 2007, 02:53:28 PM »
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In my opinion there is a more then Apparent Gagetown White-Wash.

The actions of Ottawa and the Chemical Industry of defoliant use in CFB Gagetown combined with the inactions of the same two groups to the Medical Victims from Gagetown spraying, leaves many victims shaking their heads and to be honest makes many of us feel that there is collusion between the groups.

Many of the choices for the Base Gagetown and Area Fact Finding Project (BGAFFP) and Ottawa's choice for certain studies done for that report, left much to be desired and was anything but independent or impartial.

Not only was the Sprayer (DND) the Department of National Defence placed in charge of the Project but later on the very people denying all Military Pensions for Chemical contamination in CFB Gagetown (VAC) Veterans Affairs, were placed as co-chair person for the same project by the Federal Government in Ottawa, who actually ordered the spraying in the first place.

This was called an independent study. HA!

But after doing something stupid and finding 173 time the Canadian Council of Environmental Ministers (CCME) acceptable levels for dioxin, they (Ottawa) hired an offshoot of the chemical industry to make claims of no problem, no medical concerns and to go ahead and keep contaminating soldiers as before, or carry on as normal.

But with the news that has been coming out lately, has anyone ever wondered why they seem to be finding Dioxin, HCB, Benzene, PCB, Lead and all other kinds of contamination in kids toys, Curious George, bubble gum, tin cans, date rape drugs in children's toys and so on and yet can't seem to find over 3 million liters/pounds of contaminated chemicals which they dumped on unsuspecting soldiers and anyone else who happened to be too close?

Now don't get me wrong I am all for finding and cleaning up our grand-children's toys and the food that we eat but if we continue to ignore the past, there isn't going to be a future. If Ottawa can't admit that some mistakes were made in the past and fix them, how can we possibly put our trust in these same people to clean up the future? If Ottawa and their minions continue to claim that 173 times the CCME acceptable levels for Dioxin is safe for our soldiers, how can we trust anything that Ottawa says?

Is the food that we eat safe, are the toys that Ottawa claims safe for our children really safe and top on the list is can we ever trust the safety of chemical pesticides again?

In my Opinion a Full Public and Judicial Inquiry could give Ottawa back its credibility.



 

Cpl. Kenneth H. Young CD (Ret'd).
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Re: Agent Orange Gagetown (One Angry Gagetown Victim)
« Reply #284 on: November 24, 2007, 06:00:10 PM »
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One Angry Gagetown Victim calls it like it is.

I'm angry. It shouldn't make a difference weather the chemicals sprayed in Gagetown were registered or not at the time of their use. It shouldn't even matter what their names were then, what they are called in other countries or even which contaminates are involved.

What matters is I was healthy, went to Gagetown and have never been the same since.

The fact remains that Ottawa ordered DND to spray and DND ordered the Military where and what to spray.

Many lost their lives because of it and many others had their health destroyed and it is now the Sworn DUTY not the option of VAC to give medical Pensions to these people and it has been their duty for years now.

VAC and Ottawa claiming that they will grudgingly give as many as 4,500 people out of a possible 440,000 victims $20,000, neither accepting guilt nor responsibility, for only medical conditions they themselves pick and choose and only for certain dates, is almost like saying that only causalities with 9 MM (nine Millimeter) wounds will be covered in the Afghanistan Action/war/peace making or what ever else you wish to call it, will receive a pension through the VAC and only if they can prove that they were in any given battle.

I was well and healthy, Ottawa, DND and the Military did something that made me sick during a time when I was in active duty in CFB Gagetown